Template using only tables (easy solution here)

I’m actually looking for someone to do a similar project for me. Interested? If so, email me at [email protected].

thanks!

“CSS is used mostly on simple layouts, although some would argue, CSS is a long way from being stable enough to be used by the general public”

What ?
That statement is wrong on so very many levels.
Utter garbage in fact.

Well I’m willing to bet 50 million web users would say that CSS is utter garbage from a certain point of view of course. The only people who seem to disagree are the geekazoids who spend their entire life on the web building intricate CSS files, then claiming how easy and simple it was, to me that is utter garbage ??

I’m not saying CSS is bad i’m just saying at the present it’s a toy that geeks enjoy fooling around with. Me personally, I don’t have the time to waste. Sure, I’ll learn it eventually and become better but one must study it well to be really good at it and even then not all browsers will display it without some sort of hacking. If you have to hake it to death just to make it look right in all browsers then its a waste of time.

From a maintenance or upkeep’s (or obsessive-compulsive layout changer’s) point of view CSS is absolutely wonderful. You can change the look of your site(s) easily with the change of one file, whereas with “traditional” approach you need to remember to make the changes to every single one of the dozens and dozens of files you may have (unless you have dynamic pages). Tables in structure and CSS in styling I can understand. ??

“Geekazoids”… oh, I like that

The only people who seem to disagree are the geekazoids who spend their entire life on the web building intricate CSS files…

Also known as professionals. Web design pros and those approaching their skill know CSS inside out. The random novice doesn’t. You want to rut your skills in mid-90s techniques? Go for it.

Is keeping skills up to date important or necessary for a non-professional who just keeps a homepage for fun? Of course, when the old skills don’t make working pages anymore, then it may be time for some freshening up. Then again, if left till the “last minute” it’ll be quite an ordeal to catch up.

There are people who want to keep a homepage for the content and don’t really care about the technical stuff, and there are people who keep a homepage (or several) just to have an excuse to practise web design, and of course there are people who do both. I admit I’m 70% in the 2nd group.

CSS is not a toy.
HTML is going to be slowly phased out in favor of new markups. You wouldn’t use the orginal 0.1 HTML spec from 1994 to build a new page these days would you? And I hate to burst your bubble but the table page layout is a hack designers came up with to place items in a page where they wanted them. The orginal purpose of the table tag was to layout data, not pages.
I’d say that before you start calling CSS a toy or utter garbage, you’d better spend some time getting to know your history and where markup specs are going.
After all, why do you think it’s called CSS2 and XHTML1.1?

CSS the toy for professional geekzaoids who want to make $$ and impress others with their analytical nonsense ??
CSS may be a thing of the future but it’s a long way off to being something just anyone can use, five years from now it still won’t be the bomb. Tables is more practical and easier to work with then CSS.
I rate what the average person can do with it in a short time not the professional who spent their entire life plugged into the web trends. I think even when CSS does become the standard it won’t make it any less complicated to learn. Seeing the way some designers style their CSS so complicated it makes my head spin.
I do support the cSS movement of course when i do get more into it I won’t be filling up the entire CSS page with rubbish analytical coding. I’ve already investe alot of time in studying CSS and i can tell you it ain’t all that, it’s got some nice features but it’s closer to rubbish then tables, he he. but they are both good.
The geeks will always defend the web since it’s their home in virtual land. Not me i’m a user / designer and i can see the uselessness of alot of practices out there. Geeks just want to make $$$ and impress people with their coding it never impressed me.

People doesn’t use CSS only for the sake of impressing others of their CSS skills. CSS is here for a purpose. Unless you only wanted to have a pretty website then you can have your tables. But if you wanted to change your layout pretty often then you’re out of luck if you use tables.

Anyway, nobody is forcing anybody to use CSS everywhere. It’s just a matter of choice.

but it’s closer to rubbish then tables (…) but they are both good.

CSS does not equal tables. CSS is not an alternative to tables. CSS does not equal block positioning. CSS equals getting colour, font, size, etc. styling away from cluttering up the html code.

It’s styling (as the name suggest). You just happen to be able to do positioning.

How do you style your pages? with <font>?

Sorry – got to weigh in and fuel the flames! I’m new to CSS and it is an absolute gem. The week I spent learning it was a remarkable discovery. But the main point I wanted to make that has NOT been mentioned is that CSS is important for scaling. It is the only way you are going to get content delivered to a PC, a mobile, a PDA and any other display device in the future – using the same markup and XHTML content. Pre-CSS markup wont do this without nasty hacking.
It is so nice to see short, readable HTML documents that can be easily read and understood without having to wade through reams of table, font, border and colour tags.

If anyone is remotely interested in scaling and rollout then among the less frequently stated benefits of CSS is modularisation. It is easily split up so that core elements can be reused on multi page or multi domain sites. With a dash of php it becomes a really red hot way of doing things. I am not going to get into what other people should or should not do. But for those with the time or ability to develop the skill set the benefits are awesome. Some guys dont know what they are missing. ??

If the value and point of CSS isn’t clear, check out https://www.csszengarden.com/

The same html document has been styled differently hundreds of times. Pretty impressive.

As much as I love CSS when it comes to skinning an interface, it is garbage when it comes to creating a layout without tables.

isn’t this a case of the OP not understanding CSS and therefore condemning it as, dare I say, bollocks?

It’s easy to berate something you don’t understand. CSS is not a geek thing, and about dollars, it’s (for me at least) a way to understand and manage the styling of a site better. Kiddeath91 has provided a perfect example. 1 html file, and dozens of css files providing the same content but presenting differently. Separation of content and styling is surely a better way to manage thing?

Tables are fine. To present data, as has been said time and time again. You can use tables if you want to create your site structure, but then that is a personal choice.

I think the original post has only been created to start a tepid and pointless argument. Nothing that has been said has been productive or constructive. I still have no clue as to what he means with regards to CSS being used by geeks for analytical nonsense.

This isn’t the first post to randomly start a pointless discussion which bares ignorance, and it won’t be the last. If there is to be an argument for tables, please make constructive with examples. In that regard denis has some very interesting arguments and are much more constructive, instead of some juvenile drivel about something being garbage because they don’t understand it. Utter nonsense. You can only call it garbage I suppose if you know what you’re talking about, which denis clearly does – though the views may differ ??