Why using Kubrick on 1.3 is a mistake

Wow. That’s a pretty impressive flamefest to have risen up in just over 24 hours.
How do these things start? Like most other senseless arguments, I suppose: by people jumping to conclusions.
At least 95% of this thread could have been avoided if the originator had not assumed that an adoption of the Kubrick visual style meant bringing along the other elements, as well. Okay, everybody: if you have not already seen the movie The Bad News Bears, go rent it now. Pay attention to the part about the word “assume”:

When you “assume”, you make an “ASS” out of “U” and “ME”.

That’s not aimed at anybody in particular, and it’s not intended to be a blind insult. But that saying has been illustrated particularly well in this thread, by more than one person.
Salient points here:

• Even the developers do not yet know what form the new WP design will take. All we know so far is that Matt is interested in basing the visual design on Kubrick.
• The developers consider the affect of any changes to the WP core very carefully before committing them. This has always been the case, and it always should be.
• There are other designs (or “layouts”, or whatever) out there that are also good and useful. Some of them may be “better” than Kubrick in some senses. It’s almost completely subjective.
• These forums are not the place for pissing contests. Yes, insults have been exchanged here. If you want to air your opinions on those matters, do it elsewhere, please. The best thing would probably be to try to have a civilized email exchange, keeping in mind that not everybody is on the same schedule as you. Allow ample time for responses. If your exchange results in you learning something useful for the community, share it, by all means.
• “So-and-so is a dickhead,” is not useful information for the community.
• “There are some flaws in this design when viewing in Browser X, and here is how to fix them,” is.
• Another old saying is, “You can catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.” I don’t know who the hell wants to catch flies, but we could definitely use more honey around here. Obviously, what I’m trying to get across is, “If you can’t say something nice, don’t say anything at all.”

Now, can we all get back to making WordPress better than it already is?

I think that all will end well, we just have to give it some time people. Everyone seems to be a rush to discredit, or give up WordPress. It’s quite sad.
I hope that this doesn’t discourage Matt and the team from working on WordPress, because this flaming and arguing is unacceptable.
Also, it is Matt and the team’s forum, if your post is deleted, then don’t post such things. If you can’t handle it, then maybe it’s time for a ban, because you are being redundant.

Yay! I managed to get my 2c in before this hella thread was shut down.
IMHO Michael’s Kubrick template is a fantastic piece of design. I really appreciate the obviously large amount of time and effort he put into GIVING this to the WordPress community. Big ups to Michael.
I would love to see something like this used as a default template for the new WP releases. However I can see where some people new to CSS/XHTML/PHP and graphic design would have trouble. Not everyone is as confident with these disciplines as some of us and to expect them to be able to walk straight in and customise might be too much of an ask.
This is why I think Root’s templates (bring them back Root) fill a void. They are simple and easy to customise and waaaaay better than the default layout (moot point).
Its a shame we can’t have something like this built in to the admin interface. If I was a brainy whiz-kid then I would put it in myself.
There are some wounded egos here. This just shows the passion surrounding the WP project and for that we should be happy. This could be looked at as part of the immense growth in popularity WP is facing at the moment for which we should also be happy. Can’t we all just hug and be happy?

Well, perhaps I have no right to speak, as I haven’t been particularly active on this forum, due to an unfortunate lack of time. I have to say this thread is not a pretty sight.
For any upcoming version of Word Press, I would suggest sticking to the k.i.s.s. principle: keep it simple and stupid. No matter what, users are going to break the template, and they’re more likely to break it, if it’s complicated.
I would also suggest educating users, I mean, if they know nothing at all about CSS, and don’t want to know, imho they should opt for e.g. blogger, or stick with the default template. While it’s a really nice thing to help people out, I think there’s no wrong in expecting a little effort from those that ask for help. When I started out, I knew nothing about html, xhtml, css etc. Using oodles of online tutorials, and a lot of trial and error, I managed to get enough knowledge to now have my Word Press blog skinnable (not by using the style switcher plugin but by including headers and footers and checking for that old yummie cookie) and looking decent. I have asked for help, but not after trying numerous times myself first. Once people are spoilt, they will show no effort to try and figure things out for themselves.
In ExpressionEngine, there are about 7 default templates to choose from, perhaps that would be a good idea for Word Press as well. During install, people get to pick a number for the template they wish to use. They get to see samples on the site, and if I remember well, there are also samples in the user guide that ships with the product.
I think it’s not strange that users expect a default template to be technically flawless, and that should be aimed for. As for esthetics, people’s tastes differ and always will. I like the idea gloddy came up with, although I don’t know whether such a thing would be feasible.
Anyway, just my two cents … now, with the full potential of my lack of PHP knowledge, it’s back to trying to recreate the the full calendar I had with MT, this time in Word Press …
Morgaine

ok guys and gals time out!!!
First its not the same kubrick that Mike has over binary bonsai that is going be incorporated into wordpress.
It is going to be a kubrick look alike.
Read it on Mike’s blog.
Mike has already said that,
“Now, I say ‘variation’, because some of the things that I do in Kubrick are entirely dependent on the server being setup just right (this is why there are so many problems with .htaccess for instance. So what Matt is doing, is cutting down on some of those things where needed.”
IT IS A variation.
Dont start a flame war if you dont understand or dont care to read.
Second Kubrick is modifiable to put into the default index.php.
I have done it with my limited css skills. see it at https://kunjan.net
Third Kubrick is far better then the default wordpress theme.
So this shows that ur a complete n00b.
“I will admit that it is nice on the eyes but when I tried to load it on a brand new test install (Mingus) it had htaccess problems. Then to edit it to make it have a banner graphic etc I have to edit it with photoshop??? How many people can afford photoshop. Let’s say Matt converts it out to css, is he also going to take out the plugins or expect all brand new users to learn enough on their first day to learn how to turn it on. I think it is going to be so hard to edit that most people won’t meaning very bland pages that all look alike (are we trying to become MT), I know I don’t want it so how many files will I have to delete to get rid of it but I know it was a pain to get off my test install.”
So please refrain from making such comments.

But what I don’t understand are
@matt/allusion — what are the *fundamental problems* in Root’s templates????
@michael — what are the *useability issues* with the same????
Are you really advanced guys or just making things up?????

@everyone!
This is just pathetic folks. Lets all just drop the issue and get on with life. I think everyone has fairly said their piece and everyone has been heard very clearly.
Now, get over it, put it behind you and move on. Do not perpetuate this flame by trying to continue this thread and definitely do not denegrate into pointless and pathetic insults on your own blogs. The subject is over with. If you have a problem with something someone has said, take out of the forums and email that person. Most people have linked their blogs from their profiles, so go to their sites, find their email (if its not public here already) and take the discussion elsewhere.
Harsh, but many of the posts in this thread have been totally blown out of proportion and done nothing but piss A LOT of people off.

[flame removed.]

Just make sure it works on IIS… I have been trying for weeks to touch base with Michael and I constantly see posts on his site about if you are trying to contact me try again.. cause of issue with his ISP. I now have to convert this template so that it works on IIS. I just wanted to state my opinion that is should have worked on IIS from the get go. Not everyone is using a linux server.
Kind regards,
Gravity..
I mean .. hats off to you Mike.. the template is a beaut and nicely customized, but if you have any time for an IIS work around it would be appreciated.
https://www.beachblog.net

Gravity: I should’ve mailed you (actually several times), just a few hours ago ??
Anyway, IIS can’t do Kubrick, it’s just not possible. I’ll do a write-up on why on my blog as soon as I can find the time. But don’t worry, this won’t be a problem _at all_ in 1.3.

I am curious what elements of the Kubric (or any other for that matter) will be included in 1.3. I’d like to see some examples on what the developers are working on regarding this. Perhaps not here, but on the wiki maybe. I ask this because i think the feedback of the community is very important. This also means the communication should be transparant and easy to understand, esspecially for the not so technical.
Also, i think a few templates should be included (or available for download) in the next release. I am referring to the MT default templates here. This could be a growing collection.
I can’t say anything about the templates mentioned in the earlier posts, since i haven’t used any of them. I make my own layouts and recently i made them available for the WP community. They show quite clearly what i want in a layout: simplicity.
This thread shows a lot of frustration, my suggestion is to try to keep this outside the support forum, since it got nothing to do with support. Solve the issues over a drink or two, virtually or irl. Or don’t solve them but try to remain objective towards the work of the others.